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From: "Carl CRESWELL (DBT)" ¢
Sent: Tue 30/04/2024 2:27:01 PM (UTC)
To: "Minister HOLLINRAKE (DBT)"
Ce: "Asha BALACHANDRAN2 (DB
Subject: RE: Nick Read 30/04/2024 Readout
Hi Jamie.
Thanks for doing this so quickly.
A couple of small thoughts from me below.
Carl.
oly
Carl Creswell I Director, Business Resilience
Department for Business and Trade I Old Admiralty Building, Westminster,
Lond
Department for
Business & Trade
GRO
From: Minister HOLLINRAKE (DBT) I.
Sent: Tuesday, April 30, 2024 12:25
To: Carl CRESWELL (DBT)
sha BALACHANDRAN2 (DBT)
Ed BAIRD (DBT)
Subject: Nick Read 30/04/2024 Readout
Hi Carl, Asha
As promised, here's my notes from the NR meeting today. There's one point below marked with
Attendees
Kevin Hollinrake MP
Nick Read
Simon Recaldin
Tim MclInnes
Carl Cresswell
Lorna Gratton
Jamie Lucas
Asha Balachandran
STARTS
GENERAL
Nick raised last night's Bill, asked if anything for them to be aware of.
Kevin noted it was the Scottish issue mainly. Met with some of their postmasters yesterday.
Nick introduced Charlotte, Richard's replacement as corporate affairs director.
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Nick raised agenda - central costs and compensation. Raised VOTP letter, need to be robust on
those people in the business who were involved in prosecutorial work or investigative work over
the past years. What we will commit to do, we will give you sighting on.
CENTRAL
Tim noted we've had a number of discussions about central costs. Showed the slides on Central
Costs. [have not been sent to us].
Nick jumped in to say that they completed 4 DMB closures this year. 30" of April announcements
on Manchester and Eccleston street. funding secured for 4 more DMB closures, in May. Want to
be a fully franchised organisation. Individuals within rem unit or those with past roles interesting to
the inquiry and are starting that piece of work.
Kevin raised that he's said before happy to make the case for you to HMT for capital spending.
We are not here to tell you where to make the reductions in specific strategies or commercial
decisions. I'm interested in the HQ headcount numbers being paid a small fortune - 250 FTE on
above 100k.
Tim noted that the benefits package is expensive. the perception there's a large number of people
at the top, exiting them is easier than those in the middle. With Swindon, £6m redundancy, 3 years
and 90 people out of the business. It is difficult to take out middle slithers of management within
the organisation. next step is that Karen has put in place a new structure. two of those people have
a job to see what the principles and design to take people out of the organisation.
Kevin asked how long?
Tim mentioned it would be over the summer. The board would have a discussion in June about
the future operating model and then a longer-term discussion about the next 3-5 years, probably
for Sept.
Kevin clarified that he was not talking about decisions on outsourcing. I'm talking about 250
people paid more than 100k a year. Way too top heavy to me. Reducing that headcount.
Tim agreed and said that if we look at the first annex page, would usually be a pyramid. POL is
chunky in the middle. not about going in and taking headcount out, have to do it by targeting an
operating model. NBIT will increase our headcount in IT. Changes being prioritised in commercial
and retail at the moment.
Kevin noted that's the kind of approach I want, and I'd like to see something before the summer
that covers the next 3-year period.
Lorna asked why aren't we doing retail and commercial until September?
Tim clarified that not all of it is. Point is that following exit of Owen (Deputy CEO) POL will look at
reporting lines in those sectors.
Nick chimed in that they will do incremental stuff. Trying to gear up to deliver phase 7
commitments. I'm not removing people until we've got stability.
Kevin noted that direction of travel needs to be set out first so he was keen to hear future plans by
the summer.
COMPENSATION
Simon explained the message from us on OC2, happy to help. He noted that they are
communicating with Charlotte and Carl's team. Need clarity within acceptable time about what that
disclosure looks like. Full disclosure big job and very expensive. The GLO experience has given
us good experience. The legal advisors have had good experience on what they actually need.
conveniently the GLO requirement is going to drop off as we go to completion. 57 people finishing
of GLO disclosure and will move to OC2.
Kevin noted that he was hopeful that a lot of the postmasters whose convictions are overturned by
the Bill will take the fixed sum award route anyway
Simon even to a place where no disclosure at all. Claimant lawyers may ask, “How can I advise
my client that £600k is good enough given no disclosure?”
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Simon said that they are hoping to help with Capture. Open and willing to let accountant in to have
a look. Also that they are keen to see HSS Appeals that, whenever it is ready.
Kevin still waiting for HMT I think?
Carl agreed with the minister and noted that we are working with HMT and will liaise with POL to
see if we can do the £75k top ups (not new cases) in the meantime.
Kevin agreed to chase CST on it.
Simon queried the funding agreement regarding the £75k fixed sum award for HSS.
Carl said that a funding letter is being agreed between DBT and POL. £75k for those already in
the system should be straightforward. A discussion is needed about whether a letter should go
just to that group first, separate from the wider cohort of 20k plus people.
Simon current proposal on the new £75k is to do it in house and not use services of HSF.
Kevin noted Simon's remarks.
CHAIR
Kevin found you a new chair Nick!
Nick haven't said anything internally. But meeting Nigel today.
ENDS
Jamie Lucas I Deputy Head of Office and Private Secretary to Kevin Hollinrake MP, Minister for Enterprise, Markets
and Small BusinessI
Department for Business and Trade I Old Admiralty Building I London SW1A 2DY I