Message
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From:
on behalf of
Sent:
To:
ce:
Subject:
Al,
Mark Siviter [mark.siviter@""" "GRO i
Mark Siviter <mark.siviter;
02/02/2021 07:59:52
Alisdair Cameron [alisdait
Nick Read [Nick.Read1\
[simon.oldnall:
[Tim.Perkins@r GRO FF
[amanda jones@i
RE: ARC - mails fraud update
si < Ben Foat [Ben.Foat@I_"" GRO "3; Simon Oldnall
1] Jeff Smyth [Jeff.smyth@, GRO____'Tim Perkins
I; Dan Zinner [dan.zinner@ GRO}; Amanda Jones
; Declan Salter [declan.s 'GR
On RMG I can confirm your statement is correct
Mark Siviter
Managing Director Mails & Retail
From: Declan Salter <declan.salter@_
Sent: 01 February 2021 14:06
To: Alisdair Cam: isdai
<Tim.Perkins@
<amanda.jonesi
Cc: Nick Read <Nick.Read1@:
<simon.oldnall@ .
Subject: RE: ARC - mails fraud upd.
Thanks, Al
<alisd. >; Tim Perkins
Simon Oldnall
late
FYI, it went to Carla and Tom on Friday (Tom asked for my response so I sent to both)
Kind Regards
Declan
Declan Salter
Director - Historical Matters
EA Avene Regan
WE'RE STRONGER TOGETHER post Office
Finsbury Dials
20 Finsbury Street
London, EC2Y 9AQ
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From: Alisdair Cameron <alisdair.car
Sent: 01 February 2021 12:16
To: Declan Salter <declan.salter
; Tim Perkins
ce: Nick Read <
<simon.oldnall @
Subject: RE: ARC - mails fraud update
Simon Oldnall
Thanks Declan. On the point of honest Postmasters not being affected, it would be helpful, I think, for you to revert to
Carla and Tom who I recall had clear questions — but on that specific point and assuming Jeff is now agreed?
The policing of this type of risk more broadly is with Tim P I think — right Tim?
You then leave two questions open re RMG. My understanding is that we must always flag these issues with RMG and
that has been done in this case — Mark S copied. They are keen that we let the fraud run for a time so they can secure
the evidence for a conviction. Any questions of compensation can be and is dealt with through those normal commercial
channels.
Does that work for everyone?
Thanks Al
Sent: 7 January 2021 21:3. oh 34
To: Alisdair Cameron <:
ai GRO Tim Perkins
3 Amanda Jones
Ce: Nick Read <Nick.ReadiG Ben Foat <Ben.Foat@:
<simen.oldnall @r
Subject: RE: ARC - mails fraud update
; Simon Oldnall
My report as promised; any questions, please shout.
Do you want me to forward a copy to Tom and Carla, please?
Kind Regards
Declan
Declan Salter
Director - Historical Matters
WE'RE STRONGER TOGETHER
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Post Office
Finsbury Dials
20 Finsbury Street
London, EC2Y 9AQ
From: Alisdair Cameron <alisdair.cameron@ _
Sent: 27 January 2021 15:40
>; Dan Zinner
< salter QF
Ce: Nick Read <i
j a
Subject: RE: ARC - mails fraud update
; Simon Oldnall
Ben Foat <Ben.Foat@}
Agreed — Tim do you own this action and when do we think we can collate a response? Thanks Al
a} GRO
From: Jeff Smyth <Jeff.Smyt
Sent: 26 January 2021 15:10
To: Alisdair Cameron <alisda
<dan.zinneré
<declan.salter@
Cc: Nick Read <:
<simen.oldnall@ >
Subject: RE: ARC - mails fraud update
3; Simon Oldnall
I think that we should discuss this further before we revert because in my opinion there is a loss to RMG (if labels are
printed and used on letetrs/parcels) and our consumables are being used for mails transactions. If we want to make ALL
transactions recoverable in Horizon this will require design, changes with Fujitsu and a slot for testing and release.
Thanks Jeff
From: Alisdair Cameron <alisdair.car
Sent: 26 January 2021 15:04
To: Tim Perkins <Ti ; Amanda Jones
Simon Oldnall
<simon.oldnail GRO. {>; Jeff Smyth <ieff.s
Subject: RE: ARC - mails fraud update
If you are sure we are correct, happy for you to revert directly to Tom and cc us all. Thanks Al
Sent: 26 January 2021 14:33
To: Alisdair Cam
‘Amanda Jones
Ce: Nick Read <Nick.Readi@. Simon Oldnall
<simon.oldnall@r ; Jeff Smyth <Jeff.Smythé
Subject: RE: ARC - mails fraud update
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Hi all,
My initial view on this is that there is not an issue here. I have copied Simon Oldnall (and Jeff) as I think his
perspective/understanding is worth getting.
My logic behind this not being a loss-causing issue is:
If the items are non-recoverable and power is lost, no onward settlement to a client has been processed in the
transaction, the Postmaster will not have been able to take payment for the items and net it is as though
nothing has happened. The resolution for the Postmaster is to re-process the items.
e If the items are recoverable and power is lost, the items return to the stack and the Postmaster ends the
transaction by taking payment, which is then onward settled with the client — net, the Postmaster takes the
payment that is then onwards settled leading to no loss.
So I don’t see a loss causing impact.
There could be an accidental gain if the Postmaster still took payment (not processing the payment through Horizon) as
a cash/cheque for non-recoverable items despite a disruption to power (rather than reprocessing the non-recovered
items).
Simon — what are your views? Is the above an accurate representation of how Horizon works for these transactions?
Kind regards,
T
From: Alisdair Cameron <alisdair.cameron@
Sent: 26 January 2021 13:53
To: Dan Zinner <¢a
<declan.salter¢
Cc: Nick Read <Nick. ig GRO >; Ben Foat <Ben. oat:
Subject: FW: ARC - mails fraud update
Fair questions...
From: Cooper, Tom - UKGI <
Sent: 26 January 2021 11:48
To: Carla Stent1 <Caria
Ce: Tim Parker <Ti
<alisdair.cameron@
Subject: ARC - mails fraud update
Alisdair Cameron
Carla
I thought the last paper for noting on mails fraud was rather disturbing.
The paper focuses on fraud risk but the concern it raises for me is about the integrity of Horizon records and postmaster
accounts.
On the face of it, it looks like records are lost when the Horizon is switched off in branch. In this case fraudsters used it
to their advantage. But it could also happen in a BAU context eg if there is a power failure. It seems very strange that
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Horizon would allow a label to be printed without there being a simultaneous record of the transaction being logged in
the system for revenue recognition purposes.
There were several cases in the GLO where postmasters blamed power outages for their losses.
So unless I’ve misunderstood this, it looks like this could be a rather important issue for the business and yet another
post GLO fix. Also something that warrants a fuller discussion at ARC or Board — and has this been disclosed to
claimants?
Tom
Tom Cooper
Director
UK Government Investments
1 Victoria Street I London I SW1H OET
addressed. If you
nten y
email. This footnote also
this email in
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