WITNO01500100
WITNESS: CARINA PRICE
STATEMENT NUMBER: WITNO150_01
EXHIBITS: 0
DATED: Jan 13, 2022
POST OFFICE HORIZON IT INQUIRY
FIRST WRITTEN STATEMENT OF CARINA PRICE
THIS STATEMENT IS PROVIDED IN RESPONSE TO THE RULE 9 REQUEST OF
THE PUBLIC INQUIRY DATED 29/10/2021 TO ADDRESS THE HUMAN IMPACT
OF THE FAILINGS OF THE HORIZON IT SYSTEM
I, MS CARINA PRICE, Date of Birth {~
PERSONAL BACKGROUND
1. lam currently 60 years of age.
2. Prior to my appointment as Sub Postmistress, I was an administrative manager
and a retail manager.
3. At the time, I was married with two young children.
4. Since finishing the Post Office in 2005, I have had various part time jobs over
the years. I became a director at my new partner’s business before needing to
resign due to illness. I am now on incapacity benefits.
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POST OFFICE HISTORY
5. I was appointed as Sub-postmistress of the Sopley Post Office branch, in
Dorset, in 1999.
6. I bought the business because it fitted well for my needs. My husband and I
wanted to start afresh and leave the past behind because we had marriage
difficulties.
7. We have two sons, the youngest of which was diagnosed with
I wanted to spend more time with my family to meet his needs.
8. The Post Office was in a rural area. We lived in a four bedroom house next door
which had a garden for the boys to play in.
9. It had an adjoining general store which I also owned.
10.1 employed two people to work alongside me at the Post Office - Mr Farmer and
Mrs Coles. Eventually they ran the Post Office for me. However, I still oversaw
the balancing in the Post Office.
11.1 also had a part time job at a cigarette vending machine company.
12.1 was suspended from my position in the Post Office following an unannounced
audit in 2005.
13. The name of my area manager was Mr Harvey.
14.1 only became aware of other sub-postmasters experiencing the same issues
with Horizon as me after I became aware of the JFSA, but this was quite a few
years after they terminated my contract.
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CRIMINAL ALLEGATIONS AND ANY PROCEEDINGS/CONVICTION
15.1 recall receiving error notices on the system from 2002 to 2003. From then on,
I noticed that the figures were regularly wrong and just wouldn’t balance. I would
pull my hair out not being able to understand why.
16.At first, I thought it was me making the mistakes and I repaid the initial shortfalls.
17.I phoned the helpdesk about the discrepancies in the beginning. Their attitude
was always “it will bounce back”, which I found very frustrating and unhelpful.
18.An auditor visited and I recall them saying that I can’t leave £2,000 in the
suspense account; they told me to take the money and keep it myself. I said to
him I couldn’t do that - it was the Post office’s money, and it was a reputable
place to work.
19.I had various other audits before the main one in 2005, and as mentioned above
I repaid any shortfall found at audit with my own money. I cannot recall the
amount of the discrepancies at this stage as it was all such a long time ago.
were running the post office. I was doing the weekly balance based on their
figures, and I couldn't understand why it wasn't balancing.
21.1 would spend until the early hours trying to figure it out, and in the end had to
just accept the figures and sign it off.
22.An unannounced audit was carried out by the Post Office in 2005 and a shortfall
of £13,000 was found. This was when the allegations against me arose.
23.In 2006, I was charged with numerous counts of suppressing a valuable
security and three counts of theft. I pleaded not guilty.
24.1 was convicted by a jury at Bournemouth Crown Court on 30 November 2005
to 28 counts of suppressing valuable security.
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25.1 was cleared of the charges of theft and of 12 of the charges of suppressing a
valuable security.
26.1 was sentenced on 19" January 2006 to a 9-month prison sentence which was
suspended for 2 years.
27.My conviction was subsequently quashed on appeal on 19" July 2021.
THE HUMAN IMPACT
28.The human impact which the failings of the Horizon IT System have had and
continue to have upon me and my family are set out in the remainder of this
statement. The section headings follow the particular questions posed by the
Inquiry.
WHAT WERE THE CONSEQUENCES OF BEING REQUIRED TO MAKE GOOD
APPARENT SHORTFALLS SHOWN BY THE HORIZON IT SYSTEM?
29.As mentioned above, the shortfalls were small at first and I regularly had to use
my own money to cover these.
30. The shortfalls were getting bigger and I could not afford to keep repaying them.
31.1 had to take an evening job doing bar work as well as my day job at the cigarette
vending machine company. I was exhausted from working so many hours.
32.1 also used my own takings from the shop to rectify the shortfalls.
WHAT WERE THE COSTS OF MAKING GOOD ALLEGED SHORTFALLS
SHOWN BY HORIZON?
33.1 would estimate that out of my own pocket I put in around £13,000 in total to
cover the initial ad-hoc shortfall amounts.
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34. Following the audit in 2005, I was told that I would have to pay a further shortfall
of £13,000 back. I had to take a loan out of £37,784 to cover the shortfall, my
living expenses and mortgage, believing I would be able to work and repay it.
35. It took so long to get to court I had to use the loan money to pay the mortgage
and my family’s living expenses.
36.As the case proceeded to court, my barrister informed me that the shortfalls
were in excess of £17,000. He advised me to pay it before court, but I realised
the loan I took out didn’t cover the shortfalls in addition to my living expenses
and mortgage. Instead I had to take our a further loan of £20,000 to pay the
shortfall.
HOW WERE YOU AFFECTED WHEN ALLEGED TO BE RESPONSIBLE FOR
SHORTFALLS OR DISCREPANCIES SHOWN BY THE HORIZON IT SYSTEM?
37.As mentioned above, two auditors visited the office and they implied that I had
taken the £13,000 which made me feel awful and very upset.
38.The whole situation caused me a huge amount of stress.
39.1 had so much on my plate, with the shop and my children; I thought the
shortfalls were due to my mistakes.
40.The whole experience was shocking. I couldn’t believe what was happening
and I just thought it was a big misunderstanding.
WHAT WERE THE CONSEQUENCES OF BEING HELD RESPONSIBLE FOR
SHORTFALLS AND DISCREPANCIES SHOWN BY THE HORIZON IT SYSTEM?
41.1 was invited to attend an interview. I can’t remember exactly what happened,
they just bombarded me with “this is wrong, and that is wrong”. They said
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money was going missing. I said I haven’t taken any money and I didn’t know
why it was going wrong.
42. After the interview I was suspended without pay. As mentioned above, I had to
use the loan money to live on.
43.At the time, my husband was an artist and he was not often able to contribute
financially. We had taken the children out of school and he was home schooling
them.
44.I had always been the breadwinner of the family and after my suspension we
had less income. I had to hand in my notice at the cigarette vending machine
company when I knew I was going to court.
45.1 did not look for alternative employment because I didn’t think anyone would
employ me whilst I was under investigation.
46. My physical health deteriorated at this stage and I really struggled to cope.
47.Criminal prosecutions were taken against me by the Post Office.
WHAT WERE YOUR FINANCIAL LOSSES CAUSED BY ACTION TAKEN
AGAINST YOU IN RELIANCE UPON HORIZON DATA?
48.As detailed above, due to the financial pressure I was in from the identified
shortfalls and loss of income I had to take out an initial loan of £37,784 which
was a high interest unsecured loan. Subsequently I had to take out a further
loan of £20,000.00. I also had to use various credit cards as a result of the Post
Office’s actions.
49.I hated being in debt, but I had no choice. It was not a comfortable feeling at all.
I worried about how I would pay the mortgage.
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50.At first, I missed a lot of repayments and the interest kept getting higher and
higher. I had many sleepless nights because I thought we were going to lose
the house.
51.In 2006, I set up a payment plan with a debt collection company. I have since
been able to make the monthly payments, but it is a big chunk of my monthly
income gone and I am left with just enough to get by.
52.1 have done everything in my power to make the repayments and ensure my
sons do not lose their home.
53. My new partner thas recently helped with the payments. My debt should
not be his responsibility which makes me feel dreadful.
54.1 am still paying the loans back today. I feel like I have spent my whole life living
with a huge debt hanging over my head.
55. I did not have to pay costs for legal representation as I received legal aid.
WHAT EFFECT DID IT HAVE TO BE ACCUSED OF COMMITTING CRIMINAL
OFFENCES AS A RESULT OF SHORTFALLS AND DISCREPANCIES SHOWN BY
THE HORIZON IT SYSTEM?
56.1 was horrified at the charges.
57.At the time, I was in a bad marriage and I struggled to cope. My husband just
couldn’t take the stress. I had no family support and worried all the time.
investigate the issues, but it seems they
were telling everyone that I was taking from the Post office to save my house.
They gave me grief, didn’t care and offered no help.
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59.The local newspaper published an article that said I stole from vulnerable
people. It was a very horrible article. This led to everyone in the community
finding out what was happening.
60.1 once had a good relationship with people in the village. They read the articles
and just sided with the papers, they never believed me.
61.1 went to the parish counsellors to talk it through, but they didn’t believe me
either.
62.1 felt like I was being judged every time I left my house.
63. The Post Office told my barrister that if I pleaded guilty I probably wouldn’t get
a custodial sentence. However, I was not prepared to plead guilty to something
that I didn’t do.
64.1 left Sopley a few months before the trial. I separated from my husband and I
left my sons behind.
65.1 attended hearings at both the Magistrates Court and the Crown Court.
66.1 was put on trial for something I didn’t do. The defence had a huge mountain
of paperwork which they said proved I was guilty, however, I still had hope
throughout the whole trial that the jury would find me not guilty. I cannot even
explain how this made me feel.
WHAT WERE THE CONSEQUENCES OF BEING CONVICTED OF A CRIMINAL
OFFENCE AS A RESULT OF SHORTFALLS AND DISCREPANCIES SHOWN BY
THE HORIZON IT SYSTEM?
67.In November 2005, I was found guilty by a jury at trial.
68.I was completely devasted and broke down in tears.
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69. My whole world had fallen apart. I never returned to Sopley because I thought
my family would be better off without me
70.1 felt depressed and had suicidal thoughts. I lost my home and my shop, and
as a result of this, I split up with my husband. I felt like I wanted to jump under
a lorry.
71.1 started taking anti-depressants.
72.1 went to a GP appointment and the doctor knew about my conviction and
treated me awfully. It put me off going back.
73.1 never felt that I could talk about the events. I have buried my thoughts for so
long and I am still not coping. I have never been able to move on because of
the debt.
who worked for me stayed and set up a lease for the
premises and at the time I didn’t get it checked over because I felt under a lot
of stress with what was going on. I just signed it which caused me many
problems.
75.In 2006, I went to the job centre. They could tell I was not stable, they told me
to see a doctor and I was put on incapacity benefits and job seekers allowance.
76.1 knew I wouldn’t be able to get another job because of my conviction. I just fell
apart and became more depressed.
77.\n 2007, I gradually eased myself back into working. I was able to do part time
causal work.
78.1 couldn’t face potential employers asking me about previous convictions so I
only applied for jobs where I knew they wouldn’t ask.
79.1 could not return to retail because of my conviction.
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80.1 eventually ended up helping my new partner. He owned a motorcycle
company
ut the business is coming to an end now as it is not making any
profit.
81.1 tried some cleaning work, but my health wasn’t up to it.
82.I have not been in a financial position to own another property.
83.1 moved into my current partner’s caravan and we lived there for 8 years. I was
looking after my mother at the same time. For the last 8 years we have rented
a property.
84. Had it not been for the Post Office’s actions, I would have still been working in
the Post Office. I intended to stay living in the property, and working in the Post
Office, beyond retirement.
85.This situation has affected me both mentally and physically in the most
horrendous way.
86.1 am still not coping, I become tearful when I think about what happened.
WHAT EFFECT DID THESE ISSUES HAVE UPON YOUR RELATIONSHIPS WITH
YOUR FAMILY, FRIENDS, COLLEAGUES AND LOCAL COMMUNITY?
87.My conviction had a massive effect on my relationships the community and my
family.
88.1 was not physically or mentally capable of dealing with these issues and that
is why I had to leave.
89.My husband at the time was a pensioner and my son ist il knew my
children couldn’t cope so I tried to protect them and take the debt with me. I felt
so upset.
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90. My husband and children continued to live in the house.
91.1 haven’t seen my eldest son for quite a while. He doesn’t speak to me because
I walked away.
92. When I left, my eldest son had to deal with his father’s issues and his younger
brother. He blamed me for this and he still doesn’t understand that I tried to
protect them and take the debt with me.
I wanted to be there for him and wish him
well. I went to the hospital where he had the operation and my husband told me
it wasn’t the time because I would make the situation worse.
94.1 just don’t know how to put it right with them and I blame myself.
95.1 have two grandchildren who I have never seen. I have tried reaching out, but
they don’t want anything to do with me.
96.My husband and I still don’t get on.
97.1 keep in touch with my younger son, we play games once a week.
98.My mother was dealing with my father’s illness.
Everyone came to me for support, but I couldn’t give it to them anymore. I felt
like such a failure.
PLEASE DESCRIBE THE DIRECT AND INDIRECT EFFECT WHICH THESE
ISSUES HAD UPON THE MEMBERS OF YOUR FAMILY?
99. I thought that by leaving my family it would take the pressure off them. Although
they got the house, my children went through their teenage years without a
mother in the family home.
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CONCLUDING REMARKS
100.1 have had to live with the stigma and consequences of the conviction which
has blighted my life and the lives of my immediate family. Not a day goes by
where I don’t think about it. It is a huge thing hanging over my head.
Statement Of Truth
I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true.
Signed: Position Or
"GRO I
Gerina price Uan 19,2000 083060) Office Held:
Print Full Date of signature: Jan 13, 2022
Name: CARINA PRICE
FILE REFERENCE: GRO I
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