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Witness Name: Ms Rajpal Kaur
Statement No.: WITNO221_01
Exhibits: None
Dated....1.2, ‘ ve 2. ene
THE POST OFFICE HORIZON INQUIRY
FIRST WITNESS STATEMENT OF MS RAJPAL KAUR
I, MS RAJPAL KAUR WILL SAY as follows;
INTRODUCTION
1. 1 am grateful to the Chair to be invited to provide a “human impact” statement,
concerning the physical, psychological, emotional, reputational, and financial
consequences to me and my family of being held responsible for shortfalls shown by
the Horizon IT system and Post Office Limited’s actions toward me and my family. The
initial paragraphs below provide a brief summary of my background and provide
context to the detail of the human impact of the Horizon scandal on me and my
family. This statement does not reflect a full account of my experiences or those of my
family and if necessary or required I will provide further witness statement evidence.
2. {was born on Christmas Day in }GRO# am currently living with my two sons, now aged
26 and 19. We are currently living in Leicester after a period of being forced to move
between several temporary accommodations.
BACKGROUND PRIOR TO APPOINTMENT AS SPM
2 Prior to becoming a Sub Postmistress I ran a very successful shop. I built up the
business and made a good living for myself, my husband and my 2 sons.
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DECISION TO BECOME A SPM
4. I was very ambitious and decided that the next step would be to run my own post
office, and I became the Subpostmistress of Hogsthorpe Post Office, High Street,
Hogsthorpe, Skegness, Lincolnshire PE24 5PP from July 2015 to 5 June 2017.
5. The village was idyllic. We were across from a field of horses, 5 minutes from the
beach. It was perfect for my family. We believed we would be there for the rest of
our lives, and I would run the business till my retirement, at which point my eldest
son would take over the running of the business.
6. The Hogsthorpe Village Store was an off licence, newsagents, and grocery store. I
spent a great deal of time and effort improving the appearance of the store and
would receive comments on how it had lifted the whole feel of the village. Others
were compelled to make improvements to their own homes and there was a huge
feeling of community spirit.
TRAINING AND SUPPORT
7. I had 2 weeks of training approximately 1 month prior to starting my appointment as
Subpostmistress.
8. This consisted of both off site and on-site training. The offsite training took place ina
hotel and lasted for around 3 days, and this was focused on showing us how the
equipment worked as opposed to how to work the system. The trainer did not seem
interested in training us and kept saying that if I did not understand something or
what to do, I would in time when I got into branch.
5: t also had on-site training which lasted for 5 days. We covered parcels, how to sell
stamps and general running of the business. I felt the training was not particularly
detailed and very rushed. There was a lot of book work and the trainer often
referred to the operations manual. The balance period and trading period was not
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covered in any depth. I felt that { needed far more training on the balancing process
before I should have been left alone in branch. However, my concerns were brushed
aside.
I do not believe that this was sufficient training to prepare me to use the system or
for my role as Subpostmistress. Since any supposed mistakes would come out of my
pocket, I do not believe that this training was anywhere near comprehensive
enough.
{ was not confident at all by the time I was left alone in my branch and told Post
Office this, but my concerns were merely brushed off and I was told that my
confidence would grow once I was in branch and using the system day in-day out.
I found it difficult to get the hang of the transactional side of running a Post Office
such as money laundering, postage, and cheques, let alone also learning how to use
a complex computer system on top of this. Two weeks of training was not at all
adequate.
asked Post Office for more training, and they told me I could not have it because
once I started doing it myself, I would understand. I was simply told to call the
Helpline with any problems relating to balancing and then I was left on my own.
Approximately 1 year after becoming a subpostmistress I did attend a one-day
course. This was information about products to sell and how to make more sales and
commission as opposed to the Horizon system.
{t's worth noting that when I left the Post Office, the subpostmistress who took over
from me asked me to go into the branch to help her because she also thought the
training was so lacking. I did so and have helped her since I left. The new
subpostmistress said that my help was of more value than the training offered by the
Post Office.
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subpostmistress said that my help was of more value than the training offered by the
Post Office.
HELPLINE
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I estimate that I contacted the Helpline 2-3 times per week regarding problems
relating to alleged shortfalls and /or balancing. The Helpline would tell me to look
back and start searching through the figures to try and work out how the alleged
shortfall had occurred. I could not do this and did not know how it originated and
this was why I was calling them in the first place. Contacting the Helpline never
resolved any of the issues I was having.
The Helpline would often make my situation worse. 1 sometimes contacted them
multiple times for the same problem and when I spoke to someone else, the advice
would be contradictory. t felt I was in a no-win situation.
On one occasion, I contacted the Helpline because the system was showing a £5,000
loss and this increased to £11,000. This was never rectified and the £11,000 formed
part of the total alleged shortfall that I had to repay when I left.
I expressly asked the Helpline if others had problems the way I did and they said no,
they had never had a complaint such as this and I was the only one experiencing
such difficulties.
! once went to another Post Office, and they agreed that the Helpline would be of
little use and gave me the number of an auditor (I do not recall his name) who could
help me. I called this auditor who explained that he could only come to my branch if
my line manager authorised it. I did not know who the line manager was. I did
eventually get a number but could not get through to him.
Eventually this auditor came to my branch in approximately 2016 and did a full audit
of the system and said he could not find a mistake.
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SHORTFALLS
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In this section, I set out in very brief detail my experience of shortfalls arising from
deficiencies in the Horizon IT System, and Post Office Limited’s actions as a result.
This is only a brief to provide some context to the awful impact this has had on me
and my family.
1! am only able to give approximate figures, although I do have a clear memory of
payments having been made by me. I would estimate that throughout my position in
the branch, I paid (or Post Office deducted) in excess of £25,000.
Shortfall 1: £1,600 in 2015. I think that this occurred because there were certain
things that I did not receive training on. However, I was in contact with the helpline
and followed their advice. I therefore believe that it was the system that was at fault
and not any error on my part.
Shortfall 2: £1,200 in 2015. I paid the Post Office back for this alleged shortfall from
deductions from my remuneration. I declared this to the Helpline.
Shortfall 3: £500 six months after shortfall 2. 1 paid the Post Office back for this
alleged shortfall from deductions from my remuneration. I also contacted the
Helpline.
I would then get continuous shortfalls of between £500 - £700 every two to three
months. The Helpline would repeatedly tell me this would correct itself and it was a
problem only unique to me.
Shortfall 4: £24,000 to £25,000 in June 2017. This was an accumulation of other
shortfalls within the 6 months prior to selling my branch, which I had been paying
back incrementally. This included the £11,000 which was as a result of the Helpline
giving me wrong advice and yet Post Office would not reverse or write off the debt.
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This was paid back to the Post Office out of sales monies. I had been declaring losses
to the Helpline.
AUDIT AND INVESTIGATION
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I did not have an official audit at all during my time in branch. The only time I have
been visited by an auditor was when I arranged for someone to visit my branch to
look for the shortfalls that were accruing in 2016/2017. The auditor did not identify
any transactional errors. I was told that everything I was doing was completely
correct.
I have seen no evidence of any adequate investigation even though I was assured,
and believed, that an investigation was being conducted at the time. The Post Office
would not investigate the alleged shortfalls when I asked them to.
I wrote to The Post Office at Chesterfield and asked them to investigate the alleged
£24,000 shortfall in 2017. It was a large amount of money and of obvious huge
concern for me. I spoke to someone on the helpline for this to be investigated. I
knew that there was no way that I had made a mistake of this magnitude. I told this
lady that I wanted this to be escalated and so I spoke to her manager who said there
was no mistake on the system, and it must have been my error. I even went to
another branch to find an auditor to ask that they attend my branch.
The Post Office would not send anyone out, they told me to look through my records
and try and find the mistake myself.
RESIGNATION
33.
Due to continued shortfalls at my branch, I was forced to resign. I was not suspended
pending any investigation by them. I was made to feel I was a thief and a criminal.
Word got round in the local community, and I felt shame and was constantly
questioning myself.
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I became increasingly depressed, and my marriage became strained. We were
struggling financially because we were constantly having to repay the supposed
losses each month.
I felt that I had no choice but to resign because I was losing so much money, and
because of the amount that I was paying back, ! did not get a wage in the end.
CIVIL AND CRIMINAL PROCEEDINGS
36. The Post Office did not pursue civil proceedings against me for the recovery of the
alleged shortfalls, however I lived in fear of being sued or prosecuted because of the
size of the shortfalls and the Post Office’s hard-line response to my requests for help.
LOSSES
37. 1 was led to believe that I had no alternative but to pay the shortfalls and I believed
that a thorough and fair investigation had determined that payment was due.
38. If it were not for the events that occurred, I firmly believe I would still be running my
store, my future would be secure. I invested everything into the business. It was a
perfect location. We were settled there, and my children were happy.
39. My life took a downward spiral after the accusations. I am now on medication for
depression as a result of what happened with the Post Office.
40. Things got so bad that 1 have made serious attempts to take my own life. I lost
countless hours of sleep going over paperwork and figures to try to work out where
the money was. The continuous losses were far too stressful, and I found it difficult
to cope.
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My marriage also broke down as a result of what happened with the Post Office. The
events completely devastated my life.
HUMAN IMPACT
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As I have said, I suffered serious problems with the Horizon system including alleged
shortfalls. I was compelled to make payments to the Post Office who threatened me
with suspension if I did not reconcile these alleged shortages. I estimate my losses
directly from shortfalls to be in the region of £25,000. However, the consequences of
these issues were much greater.
My husband and I divorced. We were arguing constantly. He even accused me of
stealing the money.
! suffer from depression and often experience anxiety attacks, making it impossible
for me to work. The suicidal thoughts continue, and I often find it difficult to leave
the house for fear of being judged by the community. I also have awful anxiety
attacks.
I was party to the group litigation against Post Office Ltd, as a result 1 am excluded
from the Historic Shortfall Scheme. The compensation received was a fraction of
what I lost and took no account of the loss of future opportunity or the harm to me
and my family.
The impact i experienced with the failure of the Horizon IT system has destroyed my
reputation, destroyed my family, and I was forced to sell the business.
As the shortfalls grew, I was forced to sell my car, my business and all I had to repay
the Post Office.
! constantly asked for help from the horizon team, but they made matters worse.
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The Post Office were quick to remind me that the shortfalls only happened to me.
Further intensifying my level of isolation, inadequacy and guilt.
talso believe that as a direct result my marriage collapsed. I suffered abuse from my
husband, mentally and physically. He accused me of stealing from the Post Office
and he embarrassed and belittled me. That led on to the whole village knowing the
rumors. These accusations ruined my reputation in the village, with friends and
family. This abuse later led on to our divorce.
My husband also abused and accused my eldest son (his step son), as he helped me
in the Post Office. He forced my son to separate from me and leave the family
business and home.
All this happening, led to my inability to concentrate, sleep disturbance, loss of
confidence and on many occasions attempted to commit suicide. I was so ashamed
and embarrassed to face people, as I started to believe the accusations, which
resulted in me feeling angry and restless. I spent hours trying to seek clarity to prove
my innocence. Not succeeding to find the cause of the shortfalls, I seriously believed
I was at fault.
It is only after consulting with other subpostmasters, who had experienced what I
had, that I have come to realize I was not at fault. It is of little comfort though
considering everything I have been through.
1 wasn't convicted of a criminal offence, as I decided to sell the business. However I
was warned, by the Post Office, that if I didn’t pay the discrepancies ! could end up in
jail. This terrified me.
The impact and outcome of the shortfall discrepancies, has hugely went from having
a functional business, which enabled me to become a landlord and homeowner to
now, where I barely make ends meet.
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56. ! went from being a proud businesswoman to someone who is now on benefits with
countless health issues. I have suffered mentally and physically, suffered the pain of
divorce and hit rock bottom. I have had therapy to help with anxiety and depression
and take anti-depression medication to cope with all the trauma.
57. I had to move far away because of all the embarrassment and as Asian, divorces are
not accepted in our community.
My children have also suffered
immeasurably. They lost their home, their security, their education. They are still
angry and upset. They too have had to undergo therapy to cope.
58. My heaith has deteriorated with all the constant worry and depression. My diabetes
is so unstable that it has affected my eyesight, feet and hands. I have had recently 9
operations on both my hands and still awaiting more. I suffer frequent migraines. I
have Vitiligo (skin condition), that has spread all over my body and face, this
worsened with stress. I have to use camouflage makeup to cover my face and neck.
This has knocked my confidence, further more.
59. I have very low self-esteem and can't motivate myself. The Post Office scandal has
stolen my life and confidence. Still up to this day, there’s no justice or closure. I am
still haunted by nightmares and frequent reminders. 1 want justice, compensation,
closure and an apology
STATEMENT OF TRUTH
I believe the contents of this statement to be true.
Rajpal Kaur
Signed..
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